by John Boch
Guns Save Life Executive Director
First and foremost, Guns Save Life’s website has returned! We had fallen victim to malicious hackers who used and abused our server. For those who signed up online, banking and other personal information was not handled on our server, so no worries there.
I wish I had more good news to share. At least if you know what’s coming (or rumored to be coming) this allows you more time to consider what’s the better course of action for you. So pour your favorite beverage, have a seat and fasten your seatbelt because here we go.
FOID Legal Challenge
Our lawsuit challenging the FOID Act was rejected by a circuit court judge in Springfield. We will soon be at the state’s appellate court. Regardless who wins at the appellate court, we’ll be at the Illinois Supreme Court. If they try something cute, we’ll take it on up to the US Supreme Court and let SCOTUS put the IL high court in its place.
I think it’s fair to say that Pritzker and his buddies know deep down that the FOID Act is a dead man walking. We suspect they plan on running against the courts in the next couple of election cycles.
Gun Ban Legal Challenge
We’re still waiting for the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals to rule on our lawsuit challenging the gun and magazine ban. Folks, they’re gonna rule against us. Just expect it. We’ll ask for an en banc review, but given the narrow split among justices for and against gun rights, I’m not optimistic we’ll get it. Without going all geeky, suffice it to say we’re going to be stuck with this new law and playing defense until 2024 best case, and probably 2025.
Oh, we’ll win, eventually. But those advocating for racist, classist and sexist gun control aren’t going to give up and roll over.
They’re going to fight to the bitter end, just like the racists who advocated for keeping schools segregated in the 1950s.
What’s this mean for us? I see no hope that we’ll have this blocked before the registration component of this new law kicks in. In fact, I don’t see us gaining relief until well after the registration period has closed.
You have about five months to sort out your collection and decide what you’re going to do with it. Are you going to register your guns? Move them out of state? Boating accident or burial? You must wrestle with the pros and cons to find what works for you. At least you have a few months to weigh your options.
An Illinois State Police memo from January suggested the ISP intended to take a hard-line approach to the law, but that was then. We’ll see what they’re saying in October or November.
Mom-At-Arms did a great job uncovering those memos and their full story can be found here…
Something else to think about: Will Rep. Bob Morgan introduce a new bill in January to “close the existing owner loophole” and demand owners surrender all registered guns, mags & parts?
Sources inside the Pritzker administration have hinted that the governor will advocate for just such a “close the existing owner loophole” law immediately after the first mass casualty event after registration closes. Especially if it happens in IL.
Suing to stop the registration?
Yes, that was our first inclination, too. Then we consulted legal experts. We learned that no gun registration scheme has ever been rejected by any court in America. If that wasn’t enough, we could easily end up in front of the very same three-judge panel at the Seventh Circuit Court of Appeals after spending $100k on a new lawsuit. So we’re taking a pass.
Thomas Maag from Southern Illinois might challenge it under 5th Amendment grounds, but I haven’t seen a filing. Don’t underestimate Mr. Maag though.
State Legal Challenges
Of course the Illinois high court ruled against Dan Caulkins in his lawsuit challenging the state’s new gun and magazine ban in state court. Frankly, it’s like they listened to attorney Tom DeVore in writing their decision. I’m pretty sure the Illinois Supreme Court will decline to take DeVore’s case. Like the US Supreme Court, the IL Supreme Court picks and chooses which cases it accepts.
[UPDATE: The Effingham County court dismissed Mr. DeVore’s cases in full.]
I’m not going to point fingers at Mr. Caulkins as some have done. Instead, I’m going to focus my energy on attacking the “bought and paid for” justices on the IL Supreme Court along with Pritzker & crew. I’d recommend the rest of us do the same. Eating our own isn’t going to get us where we want to go.
Don’t lose hope. Don’t give up.
It seems like we’ve got more than our fair share of rogue judges in our state. However, don’t lose hope as gun rights folks have struck down more gun control schemes nationwide in the last year (citing Bruen, in particular) than the total number of laws tossed out by the courts in the 40+ years before it.
What else is on the radar? I’m no fan of the new law that criminalizes “marketing” of firearms to youth, “militants” or those inclined to break the law. I just don’t trust the Pritzker administration not to use the law against political adversaries like Guns Save Life.
“Marketing” can mean a lot of things and no doubt they consider us “militants” in their fragile minds. With that in mind, I signed up for iDrive to ensure continuity of GSL should Pritzker’s goons show up at my house and take all of my computer gear. (I started with Dropbox but bailed on their lousy user interface.)
Radar 2.0: The “No Cash Bail” law was upheld by the state’s high court and they set September 18th as the date for implementation. Folks, two things you should do before then: 1) get concealed carry “insurance” of some sort and 2) clean and inspect your guns.
County jails will be releasing 50-75% of those held on pre-trial detention on that date. Protect yourself and your family. It’s your duty. After all, people love you and are counting on you.
For those sheriffs trying to figure out what to do with them, I stand by my earlier suggestion to rent a bus and drop them off out front of the home of the nearest politician who voted for the SAFE-T Act.
Already complied by moving my guns out of state, along with my family, possessions, and money. Life is fantastic here in sunny Central Florida and I couldn’t be any happier. Hey I can now carry without a permit, how sweet is that! Get out of that corrupt political cesspool if at all possible. In a short time that f*t*ss hitler wannabe has bought the governorship, the legislature, and now the state supreme court! There’s no stopping a dictator with boat loads of cash. The only glimmer of hope is SCOTUS and don’t count on that, if the 2024 election is also stolen the SCOTUS will be gone if not sooner.
You have the smartest way of doing it.
Lived in Central Florida for 20 years. If you think Illannoy is hot and muggy in the summer, you’ll get that for at least nine months of the year down there. Then there is the problem of trying to go anywhere, at the same time as a couple million other people. It’s like trying to drive through Chitcago, wherever you go.
Once we give ISP our information, we have lost for all time. It would appear the consensus is that we are finished here. So much for our vaunted legal team and all the money pissed away. You can have the law, the Constitution, and common sense on your side, and lose to the mouth-breathing shitwits on the left, every time.
We used to have a good country here, once. RIP America – 1789-2020.
It will only be a matter of time before legal gun owners are murdered by over-zealous ISP officers ‘enforcing’ their gun ban. The first to be targeted will be those of us who register our guns in an attempt to remain within full compliance to the new law. PICA is so poorly written that no person or entity can explain the requirements in such a way to ensure that you remain fully legal in your efforts. No matter how well-intentioned you are, the odds that you will be in violation of some part of this law are exceptionally high. PICA is grossly unconstitutional – yet in Illinois the Constitution is no longer observed or honored. We fear for our very safety at the hands of the Pritzker administration and his weaponized ISP.
It has been made clear through the rhetoric of our selected officials that legal gun owners will be shown no quarter by this government, nor does this government have any intention to assist us with remaining in compliance. We are now ruled by thugs as serfs – considered to be a threat far greater than the worst felons imaginable. The courts have abandoned us in Illinois, just as the executive and legislative branches did long ago. We have no allies.
Ruby Ridge / Waco style enforcement for simply exercising a legal right will soon be thrust upon us. History has proven over and over that no government which engages in gun control / confiscation has ever stopped at the letter of their own laws. ISP will be no different. I fully expect ISP to make examples of legal gun owners in the most brutal manner possible. Our government now fears legal ownership of guns by its citizens far more than every rapist, murderer, gang-banger and mass-shooter combined. They loathe you and I, and now possess the means to do something about it quasi-legally.
Does this all sound far-fetched? Does anyone think me wrong? Watch what happens starting January 1, 2024.
Great strategy for winning. Let’s all give up. You should join up with fat ass gov walrus and spread your demoralization to him.
I believe that those who register are falling into a trap. If these “assault weapons” are so dangerous then it would be some sort of mandatory buyback and by going full Australia on us it would probably make it more likely for a court to overturn the aggressive law. So in my little peon opinion, the registration option is something people will do by their own choosing and thus, the state can pretend to be nice and “let” you give them to a cousin in another state if you don’t want that. It’s also a wink and a nod they may have overlooked. Let’s take the gun controller’s own option: move them out of state. Translation: Sit back, shut up and take your bolt action coyote hunting instead of the AR until we see how this all pans out.
ISP already knows what you own, if you ever filled out a 4473 and completed a background check. ATF has been caught repeatedly digitizing this information. You can bet they already share it freely with LEOs all over the country. They know what you own and when you bought it. ISP will compare this data with what citizens report. If the data differs, they will be at your doorstep. Failure to register will make you a felon, whether or not you choose to move the guns out of state, since the law clearly states that you have to register even if you do that.
I wouldn’t bet that they don’t know about your private purchases, either. I have rifles that I have owned for 40 years now – one of which was purchased privately FROM an ISP officer in the 80s – that I will now have to register since it is an ‘assault rifle’.
They may know that you owned it at one time, but they have no clue as to whether or not you still do.
“I gave them all to my brother in another state to keep indefinitely.”
so…. If you are unable to move out of the state before the end of the year, Is there an actual list of banned firearms from the state?
Of course not. PICA has a long list of guns, many of which haven’t been made or imported since before 1986, but fails to list many, many variants that will simply be illegal by virtue of their appearance. Further, depending upon how you read this ‘law’, it could conceivably be used to criminalize a giant swath of existing handguns that can accept magazines over 15 rounds, or any semi-automatic shotgun. This is why I have said that the law is deliberately vague in order to ensnare otherwise well meaning gun owners as felons. This was not just sloppy bill writing by idiots that don’t know the difference between a machine gun and a super soaker; this was deliberately done.
I doubt with full knowledge of the full text of this law, and with nothing but good intent, most of us will be able to comply with PICA. We have been set up to fail.
LIBERALSR you are wrong regarding 4473’s and connections to the ISP. I am retired 28 year LEO because of my particular assignment I had close contact with ISP. I have now worked in firearms retail sales in two shops for 7 years. Most gun owners are mistaken in their knowledge of 4473’s and background checks (FTIP here in IL). As to ATF digitizing records they have been caught once and those digital records (200,000) were detroyed under court supervision. If this information was shared so ‘…freely with LEO’s all over the country” why could I not call any of that information up on LEADS ? If I wanted a gun trace I had to call ATF, who called the manufacturer, who provided the distributor, ATF calls the distributor gets the buying shop, ATF calls the shop requests a trace asking for the name and contact information of the specific buyer. This information is then telephoned or emailed to the requesting investigating officer. Please stop scaring the living piss out of people who don’t know, you apparently are in that category. ISP has NO SUCH ACCESS to 4473’s. Stop it, please.
LiberalsRCancer, you are correct saying we have no allies. The Republican Party is squarely behind the ISP because they give cops blanket and blind support. They “back the blue” not you. Senator Plummer was on Bishop on Air a couple weeks back and said he had “sympathy” for the ISP for having to deal with all of this. Sympathy for the ISP? Are you kidding me, where is the sympathy for his constituents who thought he’d look out for the 2A? Look at HB2722. The Uniparty is 100% behind the ISP. The GOP has abandoned us. They support the big and powerful and those part of the system. Us peon citizens are left out in the cold and thrown under the bus once again like ALWAYS!
Correct. We are fucked. The is no hope left to lose here in the most progressive shithole in the nation. Gun owners have more rights in the People’s Republic of California now, all thanks to Governor Butter Cow.
I neglected to mention the FTIP system asks for name, dob, foid number, and ATF defined type of purchase: handgun, long gun, other firearm. NO makes, models, serial numbers are transmitted. ATF has NEVER shown up at either Chicago area shop I worked and pulled specific 4473’s. 4473’s cannot be photographed, copied, or transmitted by investigating federal atf agents. Same goes for municipal, county, or state police who request access to a PARTICULAR 4473 IN CONNECTION with a criminal investigation. Dealers I have worked for have refused to let 4473’s be copied or photographed.
Jeff Cholewinski, thanks for your input on this. I remember from seeing FFL’s in Illinois selling a firearm to someone. They record, as you mentioned a long gun or a handgun. So from the FTIP perspective a long gun might in fact be an AR, or it could be a single shot 20 gauge, bolt action 22, lever action 30-30 or whatever. OR take a handgun, it could be one that remains “unbanned” OR it could be one with a threaded barrel and now banned but the FTIP system doesn’t know the difference. Am I correct?
Yes Casey you are correct. Many have a misunderstanding of the form 4472. It is NOT registration and no gun is “in your name”. The 4473 is a firearm transaction record. Once complete it stays at the dealer indefinitely, meaning permanently. The form is placed in a file by the dealer and later, when the forms overflow, in a banker box at the dealer’s location. The form is NOT transmitted in any way, shape, or form to ANY government agency. If the dealer’s license expires, is surrendered, revoked, or not renewed the ATF comes to the location, picks up the numerous bankers boxes filled with thousands of forms and stores them in a warehouse in West Virginia. That ATF warehouse contains millions of forms. ATF does not have manpower to do their job now… If ATF does an audit at a dealer location the agents go through a certain amount of random forms looking for compliance issues. ATF traces take place by a telephone call and rarely result in forms being transmitted to ATF. Municipal, county, and state LE agencies may have access to the form in connection with a criminal investigation. Sometimes dealers refuse this access. Regardless the investigating officer is not allowed to copy or photograph or transmit the form. The FTIP system is the IL version of the Federal background check system. I would be more worried about the Federal system as your social security number (SS numbe is bad ju-ju thanks FDR) can be entered along with your name and dob.
A little over 10 years ago a court ruled that Illannoy had to institute concealed carry, and that is the only reason we have it. Does that same court/same judges still exist, or is it now a pack of idiots?
How about you useless dumbasses sue for bruen, and heller??, oh wait there is no money in giving the people their rights after all who is going to want to be a members of the USELESS GSL AND ISRA if we have our GUNS???
So lets start on another rabit trail that will fail in in the courts so we can wait longer to get more money from the people of Illinois GUESS WHAT WE ARE DONE WITH YOU GSL!!! I JUST GAVE 2500$ TO GOA….GOA WILL FIGHT FOR OUR RIGHTS AND WIN!! NO MORE MONEY TRAIN YOUR DONE!!!!
No dumbasses abandon ALL ILLINOIS GROUPS wake up dumbasses we are loosing more of our rights every election cycle !!! They are keeping you all on the plantation with hopeium ….STOP NOW and give your money to GOA!!!! Or take your covid shot listen to the rinos (GSL ISRA) and stay where you are while they keep taking your dues and “tax deductible donations” your hard earned money to blow on their out of state houses while I and my brothers take up the fight with GOA
I understand your frustration but can’t make the connection between crooks and thieves and GSL. also don’t understand the relationship between giving money to GSL and taking the covid fakeccine. Save the crooks and thiefs for our politicians. I don’t like the ISRA as I believe that org sold us out on the FOID modernization act. I believe GSL is doing what they can here in the state. I do agree on a national level GOA, FPC (firearms policy coalition) are the most effective organizations. I have stated here I believe the Caulkins and particularly the DeVore lawsuits were worthless. I believe anyone who gave money to DeVore in the hopes of “…enjoying freedom for a while longer…” was foolish to do so. Unfortunately in this 2A fight we have to be patient and play the long game. In that respect we SHIOULD take a lesson from the Democrats, er Communists, but I repeat myself.